Blowin' Them Tires Right Off!

[OldManSTI]

Ok, this definitely qualifies as a noob question, but I'm getting frustrated:

At the beginning of December I installed new rims and snow tires in preparation for winter here in Northern Nevada. They were brand new from Tire Rack, and I got new nuts as well. Install went fine, got the TPMS programmed, and I was happy. Couple of days later I notice some noise coming from my driver side front tire, so I pull over and check it. Three of the nuts are finger loose, so I tighten them down using the emergency bar in the back and I head to the auto parts place to buy a torque wrench (I know, I shoulda had one before). Torqued the nuts to 75ft/lbs, and she seemed happy.

Today, over two months later, I'm getting some noise from the passenger rear tire. I don't pay it much mind, and we drive on. Then (after playing with a riced up Neon off of a stop light) I noticed some vibration from the rear end. We're currently in the middle of a pretty epic rain storm for the high desert, so the last thing I wanted to do was pull over and check my tires, but the noise was getting louder and I had my family in the car. So I pull over in the pouring rain and discover one nut missing, three finger loose, and effectively one nut holding the tire on. Whiskey Tango Foxtrot?!? Again, using the emergency wrench in the back, I tightened the nuts down and limped home.

So what the frack am I doing wrong? I've gone around and torqued all my nuts to 90ft/lbs (noting that several on the rear drivers tire were loose). Am I supposed to be checking my lug nuts every two weeks on my daily driver? Is this a common problem for STIs, because I've never had this problem on any of the vehicles I've owned? Do I need to put some Locktight on my lug nuts? What am I missing?

 

[IGOTASTi]

90ft/lbs is good, but what lugs do you have?

 

[Alin]

This is the first ive ever heard of such a thing.

When you had the tires put on, where was it done at? Was that place the ones to tighten your lug nuts? What lug nuts do you use?

I hand tighten all of mine and ive never had an issue.

 

[Spamby]

The nuts may not have the proper seat for the wheel. That's the only thing that comes to mind.
I've always understood it as torque the nuts to spec and then retorque after a few hundred miles. I always find a few that have backed off a few pounds but never loosey goosey and falling off, ever.

 

[Alin]

Aha [MENTION=1507]Spamby[/MENTION] i remember the thread we had where you were telling me about the way lugs seat onto the rim. :tup:

 

[Spamby]

Another point is if the tire shop now or any other time previously or previous owner has used an impact wrench on full tilt, may have stretched the studs. In that case, they'll never be right again and you'll need to replace them. This can cause the lugs to never stay torqued.

 

[OldManSTI]

This is the first ive ever heard of such a thing.

When you had the tires put on, where was it done at? Was that place the ones to tighten your lug nuts? What lug nuts do you use?

I hand tighten all of mine and ive never had an issue.

I bought the tires online from Tire Rack, mounted and ready to go, and I installed them on the car myself. No shop to blame, unfortunately. If something is messed up, that falls in my lap.

I don't know the manufacturer of the lug nuts. I used whatever they sent with the tires:

The nut on the left are the factory nuts for the factory tires. The nut on the right is what Tire Rack sent me. I noticed when comparing them that the new ones have more of a contact area, which I assumed were required for the rims.

And the rims are nothing special, just as 17" set for my snows:


Do I need to get away from the no name nuts and invest in a nice set? Is there really an advantage there, other than the color, or is a nut just a nut?

 

[OldManSTI]

Another point is if the tire shop now or any other time previously or previous owner has used an impact wrench on full tilt, may have stretched the studs. In that case, they'll never be right again and you'll need to replace them. This can cause the lugs to never stay torqued.

*gulp* So if that's the case, how hard is it to replace the studs? Or could I just get some of the "racing nuts" I've seen that'd allow the lug to pass through the nut, possibly allowing the nut further onto the lug?

 

[Spamby]

I bought the tires online from Tire Rack, mounted and ready to go, and I installed them on the car myself. No shop to blame, unfortunately. If something is messed up, that falls in my lap.

I don't know the manufacturer of the lug nuts. I used whatever they sent with the tires:
View attachment 6220
The nut on the left are the factory nuts for the factory tires. The nut on the right is what Tire Rack sent me. I noticed when comparing them that the new ones have more of a contact area, which I assumed were required for the rims.

And the rims are nothing special, just as 17" set for my snows:
View attachment 6221

Do I need to get away from the no name nuts and invest in a nice set? Is there really an advantage there, other than the color, or is a nut just a nut?

You can't compare the factory to aftermarket as aftermarket wheels usually require a different seat for the lugnut. 60* conical or taper is usually what's required.

Basically, a nuts a nut in most cases. Under extreme load as in racing or off-roading, a more expensive option may be better but for street use, just go with whatever. I've never noticed failures from cheap to expensive ones for general use.

 

[Spamby]

*gulp* So if that's the case, how hard is it to replace the studs? Or could I just get some of the "racing nuts" I've seen that'd allow the lug to pass through the nut, possibly allowing the nut further onto the lug?

Fairly easy to replace yourself. The rear is probably a little harder but definitely doable.

Tuner nuts won't help. If the studs have been stretched, they never go back. Pull on a rubber band, that's what happens when the studs stretch but they never bounce back like the rubber band. The studs would be fatigued and not safe anymore.

 

[Boogieman98]

90lbs is way too much for the stock studs. You are stretching them!! It might be time to replace them, actually I recommend that you do. I had this issue but not as bad as you it seems. Also I was getting some cross threading not because I'm and idiot but because the studs had strecthed. Lastly replace your lugs with steel lugs and not aluminum. If you need help with how to change your studs I can help with that as I just did those and the lugs

 

[OldManSTI]

Well crap, I wonder if they've been stretched and now I'm just making it worse! Ok, so if I have to replace the studs, is that something I need specialized tools for, or just patience?

 

[Boogieman98]

Very easy to change them no special tools required. I learned that studs stretch with over tightening them, tracking the car and takeing the wheels off and on.

 

[Boogieman98]

What year is your car again?

 

[OldManSTI]

2010. Pushing 60k in mileage.

 

[IGOTASTi]

So wait you're using the factory lugs at 90ft/lbs?

 

[Boogieman98]

Time to change those studs

 

[OldManSTI]

So wait you're using the factory lugs at 90ft/lbs?

When I installed the tires in November, I set them to 75ft/lbs. When the tire darn near fell off yesterday, I pushed to 90' figuring 75 wasn't enough. Apparently that was wrong. :| So I guess they could have been screwed up before, or I screwed them up yesterday. Either way, it sounds like I need to replace the wheel studs. *sigh* Any chance [MENTION=4577]TK-421[/MENTION] wants to make a how to post on replacing factory studs?

 

[Spamby]

I'm going to throw this out there because I have had experience with this.

Do you park outside? And do you have a neighbor that might not like you?

 

[Alin]

I'm going to throw this out there because I have had experience with this.
Do you park outside? And do you have a neighbor that might not like you?

No way.... Seriously!!!?

I dont want to rule it out either but wtf....