TD_D mod journey. From stock to the 'bastardmobile'
- Thread starter Td_d
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- meth injection td_d tuning
Td_d
Commander In Chief
Hmmm.... let me test a theory :lol:
I know that my WOT part of the MAF scale was scaled correctly on dyno initially - albeit with incorrect latencies and injector scaling. Given that at the top end, latencies have far less effect - and the relationship between the injector flow and the % horizontal shift in terms of trims is basically 1:1 - I could probably extrapolate back what the ballpark MAF scaling at the top end should be? Just to gauge how far off I am?
I know that my WOT part of the MAF scale was scaled correctly on dyno initially - albeit with incorrect latencies and injector scaling. Given that at the top end, latencies have far less effect - and the relationship between the injector flow and the % horizontal shift in terms of trims is basically 1:1 - I could probably extrapolate back what the ballpark MAF scaling at the top end should be? Just to gauge how far off I am?
HolyCrapItsFast
Drinks beer!
Just remember that the injector scale is a global adjustment and I forgot how off it was form the original. Prolly what you can do is apply the WOT MAF calibration from the dyno and then apply the % difference in injector scale to the new WOT MAF calibration.
So if your injector scale is now 850 and it use to be 750 then the correction to the dyno's WOT MAF scaling would be something like +12% for your current injectors. (I Think)
You'd really have to experiment with it. Either way I still wouldn't do it with out a wide band.
HolyCrapItsFast
Drinks beer!
Very true... Because whether it is knocking or not, a excessively lean mixture will result in elevated temperatures and cause your cylinder walls to over heat and fry your rings. :tup:
Td_d
Commander In Chief
Yeah - I didn't say I was going to do it 
Just interested to see how far off it was likely - I'll definately wait for the wideband to scale it properly - will have to take it easy otherwise (I gather overly rich might results in the oil seal being washed off, potential results in wear). Well - the original flow scale that it was based on was 714, whereas I'm running 767 now - so a 7.4% differential. If this is ballpark correct, I'm running quite seriously rich up top.
Just interested to see how far off it was likely - I'll definately wait for the wideband to scale it properly - will have to take it easy otherwise (I gather overly rich might results in the oil seal being washed off, potential results in wear). Well - the original flow scale that it was based on was 714, whereas I'm running 767 now - so a 7.4% differential. If this is ballpark correct, I'm running quite seriously rich up top.
Td_d
Commander In Chief
Frikkin hallelujah, my Innovate MTX-L has arrived - had to wait for a warranty return, otherwise would have ordered from Jordan. Now will need to find a time to have it installed next week some time, and then onto open loop, finally. With a couple of tweaks to tip-in and load comp tables (I found a really awesome spreadsheet that MickeyD on the open ecu forums made, much more stable than the original airboy spreadsheet - especially once you start throwing CAN logged data at it, just falls over due to the data volume), the car is driving beautifully, nice and smooth, now to make sure that all is safe up top and extract maximum powa!
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Td_d
Commander In Chief
Yup - it was down to AEM or Innovate ro make sure it works with Romraider. The great thing about the MTX-L is that the control unit is now integrated into the display (from what I gathered), so the controller is no longer in the engine bay, where it gets nice and toasty (I've had an LM-1 go funky with the wires overheating).
HolyCrapItsFast
Drinks beer!
Do you have a link to said spreadsheet!!! Does this spreadsheet take care of open loop? The other one I use only does closed loop and all the open loop stuff I either do Live tuning in ATR or log the AFR gauge and compare that against the commanded AFR in RomRaider and make adjustments accordingly.
I rarely use a spreadsheet to do the open loop stuff but I would like to too be able to better refine it.
Td_d
Commander In Chief
HolyCrapItsFast
Drinks beer!
Thank you kind sir!
Td_d
Commander In Chief
Holy - use this one rather - it's the most up to date version (just read on the forums):
http://www.romraider.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=32&t=6313&p=60882
http://www.romraider.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=32&t=6313&p=60882
Td_d
Commander In Chief
Holy - can I get you to check something for me? I'm getting knock at 2600-2950 RPM, low loads (1 - 1.35), and I'm sure it's tip in. I've seen with the CAN logging, due to the resolution, you have to look back a couple of cells to see the trend. Before I belt up the tip-in table, could you have a look for me? It either that or more tweaking to load compensation...
http://dl.dropbox.com/u/3099895/log0021.zip
Thanks!
http://dl.dropbox.com/u/3099895/log0021.zip
Thanks!
Td_d
Commander In Chief
Had an interesting conversation today, made me think of something :lol:. Went to go and pick up the toluene xylene methanol mix I used to use (octane booster, whilst working awesomely, is also friggin expensive), and bumped into a guy that manufactures a local octane booster (from what I've read not highly rates, chuckle), but he was there picking up ethanol. He's running his car completely on ethanol i.e. E100, and given that we don't have it in the pumps here, he's got a 1000l canister at home that is refilled for him every couple of months (not outrageously huge either - about 1 x 1 x 1.8m). 1000l, at 60l per tank would comfortably give me 2 months plus per refill, and much cheaper than gas (due to oil prices and exchange rate, gas prices are high at the moment, over R10 per litre - ethanol is about R6/l)/ I wonder if I should seriously consider this, or if it would be a major mission. Never mind the obvious power advantages of ethanol...
HolyCrapItsFast
Drinks beer!
I can say beyond a shadow of doubt that this is not tip in related. Most of it is learned and it is small so if you simply remove about three degrees of timing in those load/rpm regions from your primary ignition table A,B,C then you should be fine. If that has no effect then it is noise.
Is there any knock at WOT?
Dooo Eeet!!! No brainer!
Td_d
Commander In Chief
Zero knock at WOT, absolutely clean, and pulling like a beast - should be even better once I've managed to properly scale open loop. Ok - that's a relief - wasn't sure which way to go - timing or fueling...
Yeah - I am seriously tempted with the ethanol - never realised that it could be so practical. I'd definitely need bigger injectors - 1000's? 1200's? Yay - new scaling! :tard:
Yeah - I am seriously tempted with the ethanol - never realised that it could be so practical. I'd definitely need bigger injectors - 1000's? 1200's? Yay - new scaling! :tard:
HolyCrapItsFast
Drinks beer!
Insanely small IPW coupled with greater than stock cams will cause idle issues on gas at stock Idle level. You will need to increase your idle for sure. Probably 1000 rpm. At that point you might be running the injectors at latency only IPW and your idle trims will be all over the place. And you will have to adjust your roughness thresholds at low RPM to reduce misfire codes. I'm thinking you will not need anything more than 1200-1400cc but that is with E85 in mind. Not really sure what the impact would be with E100.
It is doable though with 2000's, you just need tune properly for them or have a monster crazy insane build like fugi!!!
It is doable though with 2000's, you just need tune properly for them or have a monster crazy insane build like fugi!!!
Td_d
Commander In Chief
Yeah... unlike Fuji, I'm sane! :tard: Frankly, I like having the STI as a DD, so driveability remains an issue for me.
Well, I've got 2/3 months worth of octane juice, so I can do some research in terms of costs, practicality etc. in the mean time (whilst I finally get these injector properly scaled up top!).
I guess I could also leave the meth injection installed, but off - so that if I do need to switch to gas maps (say in another town, vacation, whatever), I can still use meth to keep octane and knock suppression up.
Hmm... to explain to my wife what this giant plastic cube of flammable material is doing hanging about would be interesting too
Well, I've got 2/3 months worth of octane juice, so I can do some research in terms of costs, practicality etc. in the mean time (whilst I finally get these injector properly scaled up top!).
I guess I could also leave the meth injection installed, but off - so that if I do need to switch to gas maps (say in another town, vacation, whatever), I can still use meth to keep octane and knock suppression up.
Hmm... to explain to my wife what this giant plastic cube of flammable material is doing hanging about would be interesting too
HolyCrapItsFast
Drinks beer!
Yeah... unlike Fuji, I'm sane! :tard: Frankly, I like having the STI as a DD, so driveability remains an issue for me.
Well, I've got 2/3 months worth of octane juice, so I can do some research in terms of costs, practicality etc. in the mean time (whilst I finally get these injector properly scaled up top!).
I guess I could also leave the meth injection installed, but off - so that if I do need to switch to gas maps (say in another town, vacation, whatever), I can still use meth to keep octane and knock suppression up.
Hmm... to explain to my wife what this giant plastic cube of flammable material is doing hanging about would be interesting too
The thing is though it is an insane build... to me what makes it insane is that with all he will accomplish it will still be suitable as a DD. It has everything to do with strategic parts selection and strategic tuning. He has that knowledge and can pull it off.
