TD_D mod journey. From stock to the 'bastardmobile'

[Td_d]

LOL!

Busy transferring the maps across - I've got so much patched into my current rom, I figured I would use a clean rom. patch it, and then move the new maps onto it. Time consuming...

On another note, it's finally time to replace the stocker tires. Must say, considering the abuse they've taken, 40000km on the stock dunlops is not half bad... Getting a great deal on a a set of 265/35/R18's - yeah! Fat ones!

Holy - question for you - you figure a slightly loose intercooler (I need to have the brackets remachined, not sitting nicely due to the size of the TMIC) could cause a whole lot of false knock?

I'm getting silly amounts of knock at low load, especially on hard throttle on (i.e. going from 15-20% throttle to 100% on a stab), which are not making sense to me. Fueling is tracking quite well, tip in enrichment is also doing it's part - I'm not really getting a spike in AFRs, and loads are low (but rising quickly - so from 1.1 up to 1.6, somtimes lower - 1.1 to 1.3) always around 2400 to 3200 rpms. Timing is also not outrageous - 25-26* at starting point - 2400-2600 rpms and low loads of 1.1 - in fact lower than the norm I believe. Other than that, I'm also getting constant low knock - 1.4 pulled at 2800-2900. I guess I should organise some det cans and verify whether it's real or not - doesn't make sense though - boost is generally still in slight vacuum as well (10~11 PSI absolute - atmospheric is roughly 12psi here).

It's driving me nuts... can I send you a log (I warn you, it's huge!) - I need another set of eyes.

 

[Td_d]

Here's the log (a meagre 13Mb ) http://dl.dropbox.com/u/3099895/log0249.rar

 

[HolyCrapItsFast]

It is possible but it is more like not... Noise doesn't transfer very well from the body to the engine and I would imagine you also have silicone couplers which vibration also does not transfer through very well. I would say that any noise that is created by the brackets for the FMIC is isolated but you never know... You have a built block right? I would blame it more on forged internals first.

I was going to ask for a log but I see you already posted... Let me have a look and see if anything makes sense.

Have you removed timing in these areas? did it make a difference? If not then that points to noise.

 

[HolyCrapItsFast]

That looks like real knock to me... Can you please send me a copy of your rom for reference?

You might also want to clean up your fuel trims during open loop... It is removeing 2% in open lood and typically all your fuel trims should be zero immediately upon transitioning to open loop.

 

[Vermont]

That looks like real knock to me... Can you please send me a copy of your rom for reference?

You might also want to clean up your fuel trims during open loop... It is removeing 2% in open lood and typically all your fuel trims should be zero immediately upon transitioning to open loop.

I'm not the best person in the world at this stuff but that does look like real knock as well.... Look at how it gradually decreases over the time of the pull each time. It is not a single instance that is popping up then disappearing rapidly. No this is something much more constant. Also you have quite a bit of FLKC as well you might want to look into. Also the FBKC seems to be highest around instances of higher IATs. you might want to look into that as well. I don't know what the ambient was that day, Looked like 80's right?but on more than a few runs you were over the mid 90s with tons of knock popping up and relatively lean AFR's. I do think that pulling some of the timing in what looks to be the spool area and adding a little bit of fuel will make this disappear... Either that or you have a bolt loose that is banging around in the back of your engine.... No TMIC being loose would cause this much false knock. also if it was a loose piece of equipment then you should be able to see a crap load of FBKC and FLKC under light load as well. But there is none. All of the knock is under OL.

Just my 2cp on this man. Not sure if it will even help you out but I like to stick my nose into others business and mess about...

 

[Td_d]

Yeah, it felt like real knock - thing is I've pulled timing, raised it, pulled it, always get knock right at that spot - hence the FLKC at that spot. High IATs? Jeeze... things have started cooling here! Believe it or not, at the time of the heat wave - when my MAF housing cracked like - I would see IATs of 145 at warm start sometimes :shock:

I'll pull a couple degrees of timing there about - actually looking at it now, the final fueling targeted is silly lean for the manifold aboslute pressure going above 0. I've noticed that my stated load is now lower using SD than it was with MAF - so it seems to have pushed the whole table to the side - which means timing fueling is off.

I have to admit, I sometimes get tired of fiddling, guess that why I missed it. Tuning fatigue

Thanks for the heads up - will richen up there and pull some timing.

 

[HolyCrapItsFast]

Try richening first..i you don't want to pull to much timiming because you will risk losing your drivability... That's why I wanted to see your rom so I could steer you in the right direction.

 

[Td_d]

Yeah - that's exactly what I'm doing - reason I didn't pick it up is that the fueling was not unreasonable at that area given the load - but with the SD rom, I see that boost is actually much higher at lower loads now, which means load is probably higher than is being reported. That combined with high wastegate pressure, and boost onset quicker equals knock... I really need to set the IAT tables to pull 2~3 degrees of timing at the top few cells as well, never got round to it.

I'll pm you my rom as well - thanks George.

 

[Td_d]

By the way - the rom I sent you is the one on which the knock happened - I've now dropped AFRs in the open loop fueling table by 0.3 to 0.5 points.

 

[Vermont]

By the way - the rom I sent you is the one on which the knock happened - I've now dropped AFRs in the open loop fueling table by 0.3 to 0.5 points.

Once you get around to doing a few logs, would you mind posting up if it worked or not?

 

[Td_d]

Sure, will do.

 

[Td_d]

About 2 / 3 months ago, been a while since I checked for boost leaks.

 

[Td_d]

Too early to call it, but richening it up earlier (in the upper twelves by engine load = 1) seems to have helped - have not had FBKC in the few small logs that I managed to run today.

The CEL flash on knock in the new rom I'm testing is the bomb! So handy to have!

Since I implemented the no filtering / dampening on calculated engine load, I've also got a rock steady idle. Dropped it to 750 today - keep in mind these are 1200cc injectors - didn't flinch. I'm really liking speed density.

With the wastegate pressure set higher in the EBCS now, I'm also getting to target boost quicker now.

Also loving my new 265/35/18 tires... they look viciously wide...

 

[HolyCrapItsFast]

Wow nice idle... and don't you have 272 cam to boot?

 

[Vermont]

Too early to call it, but richening it up earlier (in the upper twelves by engine load = 1) seems to have helped - have not had FBKC in the few small logs that I managed to run today.

The CEL flash on knock in the new rom I'm testing is the bomb! So handy to have!

Since I implemented the no filtering / dampening on calculated engine load, I've also got a rock steady idle. Dropped it to 750 today - keep in mind these are 1200cc injectors - didn't flinch. I'm really liking speed density.

With the wastegate pressure set higher in the EBCS now, I'm also getting to target boost quicker now.

Also loving my new 265/35/18 tires... they look viciously wide...

Cel flash on knock? Tell me more.... This sounds like an awesome feature....

 

[Td_d]

No - sadly - I ordered them originally when the engine was built, but the wrong one's came in (272's for the 2.0l engine) - so never went in.

I just haven't had the energy to have more engine work done since, given the potential down time. But I'm itching to go rotated, front mount and something the size of an 35R now :twisted:

You'll appreciate this as an engineer - it was an interesting process digging through these routines - literally every variable fed to the ECU is fed through a "low pass filter routine", used to even out spikes:

filtered variable = (filter_weight x raw_value) + ((1 - filter_weight) x previous value))

Seems the MAP sensor has very different characteristics to the MAF sensor, and the heavy filtering used for MAF causes fueling to respond too slowly, which caused a whole lot of cycling and overshooting issues on rapid MAP changes. Switch off the filtering - rock steady.

 

[Td_d]

Cel flash on knock? Tell me more.... This sounds like an awesome feature....

Oh yeah! Think Tephra's mod for the evos - the CEL indicator on the dash lights up every time you get knock, depending on the threshhold you set (i.e. -1, -1.5 etc.). Damn useful - and it catches your eye instantly.

See here: http://www.romraider.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=37&t=8263

 

[Td_d]

Here's what it looks like - there's also a great feature that allows you to recall IAM status by depressing clutch and cruise set at the same time.

 

[Td_d]

Yeah, well - still getting knock with a richer mix - with the CEL knock it's making it much easier to see exactly when now.

See this log http://dl.dropbox.com/u/3099895/log0266.rar

That's why I'm really questioning whether this is the real deal, or whether it's due to the built engine or something rattling. It seems to happen during a very specific event - when shifting from 2nd to 3rd, crusing in 2nd - i.e engine loads at 0.2 ~ 0.3 AFRs 14.7, and then accelerating fast out of 3rd - i.e. engine load is going from 0.2 right up to 1.5 in a matter of under a second (~25 cells at 40ms), MAP is rising very fast - but still in vacuum (MAP of just under 12PSI). Using the resistance / current method, EGTs are still healthy. IATs are actually quite low - was cool this morning.

If anything, fueling is now too rich with slightly colder weather - targeting 11.7 during the event, but dropping to 10.2. Rich knock?

 

[Vermont]

Yeah, well - still getting knock with a richer mix - with the CEL knock it's making it much easier to see exactly when now.

See this log http://dl.dropbox.com/u/3099895/log0266.rar

That's why I'm really questioning whether this is the real deal, or whether it's due to the built engine or something rattling. It seems to happen during a very specific event - when shifting from 2nd to 3rd, crusing in 2nd - i.e engine loads at 0.2 ~ 0.3 AFRs 14.7, and then accelerating fast out of 3rd - i.e. engine load is going from 0.2 right up to 1.5 in a matter of under a second (~25 cells at 40ms), MAP is rising very fast - but still in vacuum (MAP of just under 12PSI). Using the resistance / current method, EGTs are still healthy. IATs are actually quite low - was cool this morning.

If anything, fueling is now too rich with slightly colder weather - targeting 11.7 during the event, but dropping to 10.2. Rich knock?

You won't see rich knock until you are in the low 9s trust me on this. I had a bad front O2 once that caused me to run pig rich under CL and i was getting rich knock and rich miss fires. AFR gauge was bellow 10 (AEM don't go any lower). At this point I have no idea what it might be man... I would hesitate to say it is false knock and rule it out completely. Have you always had this knock with this engine? If it just started recently then I would pin it down to either something wrong or something loose...